Can Doctrinal “Development” Flout the Laws of Logic?

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    Brian W • a month ago

    Two things strike me here--and the first I've been saying repetitively:

    1) St. Anthony of the Desert said in the fourth century (1,700 or more years ago) that we will know we are in the end times when:
    “Men will surrender to the spirit of the age. They will say that if they had lived in our day, Faith would be simple and easy. But in their day, they will say, things are complex; the Church must be brought up to date and made meaningful to the day’s problems. When the Church and the world are one, then those days are at hand because our Divine Master placed a barrier between His things and the things of the world.”

    2) We know what this means from a standpoint of tearing down Church doctrine and indeed the Church. Those are symptoms. The problem: the people peddling these doctrines don't believe in eternity. Everything is about the hardship of life on Earth, about the here and now. Anybody capable of reasonable thought would concede that risking disobedience to God in order to be comfortable or popular for 70 to 80 years on Earth is absolutely asinine when compared to burning in Hell for eternity. So when people who are supposed to believe in the Four Last Things seem not to believe in three of the four things, what is the problem? What do they believe? What do they not believe? Who do they serve?

    Those are the bigger questions for us. It feels like we're in a spiritual war.

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    veritasetgratia Brian W • a month ago

    Well said. I came across a quote (perhaps from St.Athanasius) regarding the thinking of the opposition during the Arian heresy. They were saying then that what they needed was a Creed worded in such a way that most people could accept it! Well hello! That's the same thinking, basically right from the earliest years of Christianity. As you say so well above, "the spirit of the age" but it seems that spirit has been around perhaps from the Garden of Eden!

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    Eric P veritasetgratia • 25 days ago

    St. Athanasisus is one of my favorite saints to study. i have a question....The Pope's recent remarks, in what way does this fall outside the power of his office to be infallible? what condition is violated? thank you.

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    veritasetgratia Eric P • 25 days ago

    What helped me to better understand the infallibility of the Pope, was reading that every Pope as a Catholic, must first of all be a faithful orthodox Catholic himself. So he must accept what the Church has taught consistently, in every time/epoch, from the beginning. Pope Benedict said no Pope can just decide to ditch what was previously taught by the Catholic Church. The role of the Pope is to defend, to defend the Faith which was handed down to him. The Pope is infallible only when he teaches regarding faith and morals, but even on these two subjects, he must be faithful to the apostolic truth as taught by Jesus Christ. None of us should walk away from what the Church has always taught because we are answerable to God. Each of us Catholics needs to be increasing our knowledge of the Faith constantly during these dark days. Otherwise, we will not be sure what the Church has taught in the past. Other essentials - I believe we all need to be attending a parish with a very knowledgeable faithful Catholic parish priest. That priest will need our support right now. We all need to have personal relationships with even a few faithful knowledgeable Catholics as well. That way, we always have someone not too far away with whom we can speak and clear up concerns. Essential : the Rosary and as many Masses as you can attend. God bless you and lead you.

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  winslow Brian W • 25 days ago

  There can be no doubt, Brian, that Bergoglio is a manifest heretic, an enemy of Our Lord and a tool of Satan. There can be no doubt he does not believe in God, let alone eternity. The only question left is, are there any faithful Cardinals, bishops and priests with the courage to band together and rid the Lord's Church of this monster?

  Silly question. Cardinal Burke cannot even bring himself to pronounce his long awaited formal correction of Bergoglio as it continues to gather dust in the closet of his 'to do' list. Without Christ, we can do nothing, and we're doing it.

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    Deacon_Augustine winslow • 25 days ago

    It is quite possible that the formal correction has already been made and is simply not public yet. It took several months for them to go public with the dubia after they had given him reasonable time to respond.

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  Liturgically Abused • a month ago

  Who agrees with me that we have THE WORST pope in history at the moment? I don't think there has been a pope before who deliberately tries to white-ant the Catholic Faith - to use his office to deliberately attempt to change the faith. All other 'bad' popes were merely sexual sinners, greedy or confused about developing doctrine, but never deliberately putting themselves above revealed truth.

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  James Liturgically Abused • a month ago

  You are without doubt absolutely correct.
  The man is a loose cannon, unhinged, theologically moronic and ill willed. The office has enhanced the hubris he has been running on since he was an adolescent. Geriatric diminishment is only aggravating the situation. He thinks its still the golden sixties.
  And then you have him surrounded by sycophants and puppet masters massaging his ego.
  It reminds me a little of "Arsenic and Old Lace" with the batty old uncle -- or whatever -- under the illusion he is Teddy Roosevelt and running up and down the stairs he believes to be San Juan Hill.
  Well guess who Jorge Mario Bergoglio thinks he is?
  We have one big problem on our hands.

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  davidc James • a month ago

  It is the sixties again. The forces of modernism waited out JPII and BXVI and have re-emerged from the woodwork, so to speak, now that they have one of their own on the throne of Peter. They are simply picking up where they left off.

  All I can say is: Jesus, save us!

  The Triumph of the Immaculate Heart of Mary can't come too quickly.

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  winslow Liturgically Abused • 25 days ago

  For heresy and contempt for Our Lord, Bergoglio is in a class by himself.

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  James M Liturgically Abused • 23 days ago

  Disagree strongly. P6 and JP2 are arguably very much worse than PF. JP2 legalised sacrilege, by approving Canon 844#4 in the 1983 Code:

  Can. 844 §1. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments licitly to Catholic members of the Christian faithful alone, who likewise receive them licitly from Catholic ministers alone, without prejudice to the prescripts of §§2, 3, and 4 of this canon, and ⇒ can. 861, §2.

  §2. Whenever necessity requires it or true spiritual advantage suggests it, and provided that danger of error or of indifferentism is avoided, the Christian faithful for whom it is physically or morally impossible to approach a Catholic minister are permitted to receive the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick from non-

  Catholic ministers in whose Churches these sacraments are valid.

  §3. Catholic ministers administer the sacraments of penance, Eucharist, and anointing of the sick licitly to members of Eastern Churches which do not have full communion with the Catholic Church if they seek such on their own accord and are properly disposed. This is also valid for members of other Churches which in the judgment of the Apostolic See are in the same condition in regard to the sacraments as these Eastern Churches.

  §4. If the danger of death is present or if, in the judgment of the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops, some other grave necessity urges it, Catholic ministers administer these same sacraments licitly also to other Christians not having full communion with the Catholic Church, who cannot approach a minister of their own community and who seek such on their own accord, provided that they manifest Catholic faith in respect to these sacraments and are properly disposed.

  §5. For the cases mentioned in §§2, 3, and 4, the diocesan bishop or conference of bishops is not to issue general norms except after consultation at least with the local competent authority of the interested non-Catholic Church or community.

  http://www.vatican.va/archi...

  Canon 844.4 contradicts (and totally guts) 844.1. PF has merely taken the garbage allowed by JP2 a step further. And how can schismatics and heretics profess a Catholic Faith they do not possess ? The habit of faith is a unity, so that one cannot have the virtue or the habit of faith so as to profess one dogma in the Catholic sense and as a Catholic, without professing all dogmas, in that sense, with that virtue and habit, and thus, being a Catholic.
  Those who want to read more antiCatholic garbage allowed by JP2 should take a look at this next document, from 1993, which is not for the easily upset:

  “b) Sharing Sacramental Life with Christians of Other Churches and Ecclesial Communities

  129. A sacrament is an act of Christ and of the Church through the Spirit.130 Its celebration in a concrete community is the sign of the reality of its unity in faith, worship and community life. As well as being signs, sacraments—most specially the Eucharist—are sources of the unity of the Christian community and of spiritual life, and are means for building them up. Thus Eucharistic communion is inseparably linked to full ecclesial communion and its visible expression.

  At the same time, the Catholic Church teaches that by baptism members of other Churches and ecclesial Communities are brought into a real, even if imperfect communion, with the Catholic Church 131 and that "baptism, which constitutes the sacramental bond of unity existing among all who through it are reborn... is wholly directed toward the acquiring of fullness of life in Christ".132 The Eucharist is, for the baptized, a spiritual food which enables them to overcome sin and to live the very life of Christ, to be incorporated more profoundly in Him and share more intensely in the whole economy of the Mystery of Christ.

  It is in the light of these two basic principles, which must always be taken into account together, that in general the Catholic Church permits access to its Eucharistic communion and to the sacraments of penance and anointing of the sick, only to those who share its oneness in faith, worship and ecclesial life.133 For the same reasons, it also recognizes that in certain circumstances, by way of exception, and under certain conditions, access to these sacraments may be permitted, or even commended, for Christians of other Churches and ecclesial Communities.134

  130. In case of danger of death, Catholic ministers may administer these sacraments when the conditions given below (n. 131) are present. In other cases, it is strongly recommended that the diocesan Bishop, taking into account any norms which may have been established for this matter by the Episcopal Conference or by the Synods of Eastern Catholic Churches, establish general norms for judging situations of grave and pressing need and for verifying the conditions mentioned below (n. 131).135 In accord with Canon Law,136 these general norms are to be established only after consultation with at least the local competent authority of the other interested Church or ecclesial Community. Catholic ministers will judge individual cases and administer these sacraments only in accord with these established norms, where they exist. Otherwise they will judge according to the norms of this Directory.

  131. The conditions under which a Catholic minister may administer the sacraments of the Eucharist, of penance and of the anointing of the sick to a baptized person who may be found in the circumstances given above (n. 130) are that the person be unable to have recourse for the sacrament desired to a minister of his or her own Church or ecclesial Community, ask for the sacrament of his or her own initiative, manifest Catholic faith in this sacrament and be properly disposed.137

  132. On the basis of the Catholic doctrine concerning the sacraments and their validity, a Catholic who finds himself or herself in the circumstances mentioned above (nn. 130 and 131) may ask for these sacraments only from a minister in whose Church these sacraments are valid or from one who is known to be validly ordained according to the Catholic teaching on ordination.

  133. The reading of Scripture during a Eucharistic celebration in the Catholic Church is to be done by members of that Church. On exceptional occasions and for a just cause, the Bishop of the diocese may permit a member of another Church or ecclesial Community to take on the task of reader.

  134. In the Catholic Eucharistic Liturgy, the homily which forms part of the liturgy itself is reserved to the priest or deacon, since it is the presentation of the mysteries of faith and the norms of Christian living in accordance with Catholic teaching and tradition.138

  135. For the reading of Scripture and preaching during other than Eucharistic celebrations, the norms given above (n. 118) are to be applied.

  136. Members of other Churches or ecclesial Communities may be witnesses at the celebration of marriage in a Catholic church. Catholics may also be witnesses at marriages which are celebrated in other Churches or ecclesial Communities.”

  http://www.vatican.va/roman...

  This is “Little Britain” ecumenism: the Church says something must not be done - then qualifies its prohibition, and the reasons for it, into nothingness. This is a version of the tactic practiced in Dignitatis Humanae, and by PF. In effect, the Church is giving a legal basis for indifferentism, while denying it is practicing indifferentism. And this has been going on since 1993.